The global church has seen its fill of horrors: pastors and priests betraying their call by sinning and deflating congregants' attitudes toward Christianity. And yet the broader culture still makes evident a hunger for transcendence: spirituality is on the rise. So what, respectively, do religion and spirituality take as their focus and their telos? I compare spirituality and religion in this episode. Along the way I also share more strategic questions one might ask in thoughtful conversations. Come think and laugh with me!